Greta Van Den Brink on her single "Bodies"

With the release of her new song "Bodies," I had the chance to chat with artist Greta Van Den Brink, and here is how it went.

Did you grow up loving music, and how did you get into music?

“I grew up loving music. My dad, raised in the 40s and 50s, always played love songs and sang around the house. Mum didn’t listen to much music, so I didn’t have much influence there. I mostly listened to whatever was popular to fit in. At 19, I started finding songs that truly moved me and developed my own taste.”

Do you feel New Zealand radio’s focus on a specific sound makes it difficult to explore other musical styles?

“I agree, New Zealand radio does seem fixed on a specific sound. As a teenager, you’re experiencing new emotions, and I connected with darker, more yearning music privately. My friends listened to different rappers and upbeat stuff, but I was just in my feelings.”

Does New Zealand radio’s narrow sound make it challenging to introduce your own style?

“That’s an interesting question. My sound is different, but it still has the digestibility of pop, which is common on New Zealand radio, so I think I can fit in. Breaking in is a challenge, regardless, because I’m new. At one point, I described my music as Americana Indie Pop with a soft rock influence. Before I released anything, we recorded the whole album, and I realised my music didn’t match what was popular in New Zealand. That panicked me for a moment. But I decided it was better to be myself and not recreate someone else’s work. You need your own sound and story. I definitely doubted myself, but I moved past it.”

Who are some of your main creative inspirations, musicians or otherwise?

“There are a lot of inspirations, ranging from music to film. When I write, I visualise what’s happening. Musically, I’m hugely influenced by Lana Del Rey. I love her storytelling, and her songs feel very visual, especially White Feather Hawk Tail Deer Hunter. I also love Sabrina Carpenter and admire the world's artists create. James Vincent McMorrow inspired me, as did Lady Gaga, especially her Joanne album. That album showed me that an album can change sonically and move through genres, which I enjoy. Hosier’s storytelling and interviews are also inspiring. He’s so well read and interesting to listen to. Listening to these artists feels nourishing, like a good meal you want to savour. From film, I’ve been inspired by Emerald Fennell’s Saltburn and Guillermo del Toro’s films, especially Pan’s Labyrinth. Authors like Barbara Kingsolver, who wrote Demon Copperhead, have also influenced me. In hindsight, my song Alpine State of Mind lives in the world her book created. Ultimately, whatever you consume becomes part of your subconscious and comes out in your art.”

That’s interesting what you said about visual worlds. With your background in stunts and acting, how much of your music comes from seeing it visually versus sounds and influences?

“It’s a huge part of my process. Maybe it’s a mix of who I am and my background on sets, but when I’m writing, I see it visually and can describe exactly what I’m seeing. Many of my lyrics are images in my head, like scenes unfolding. I can tell you the temperature, what the air feels like, and sense the tension in the room. It almost feels like a cheat code for writing, because I’m just describing what I see. I’m not creating it. I’m just revealing what’s already there. It’s a strange feeling.”

Thinking about your new song Bodies, what landscape or climate do you imagine it inhabits?

“Because it’s such an amalgamation of different worlds in my head, when I was writing it, it felt like a mixture of anxiety. It felt like a mixture of this sort of underbelly of Hollywood that I was confused and scared by, and then it also felt like stunts, because I’ve felt that way before on sets where you’re a replaceable body. But what I really saw was, have you seen Babylon? There’s this crazy part in the film where they go almost underground through these tunnels in LA, and it feels like there’s a party happening in one of those underground tunnels. It feels like the earth is around you, but there’s a lot of glitz and glamour, there’s sweat, and everyone is high out of their minds. It feels like it lives there, and it kind of feels like an observer walking through there, like you’re in the costume, but you’re kind of confused by it all. That’s where I think that lives.”

Do the visual worlds you imagine for your music influence your ideas for music videos?

“That’s an interesting question. I was talking to someone about this recently. I think the visuals that inspire the song aren’t always the same as those that inspire the video. For example, with God, it must be good to be loved by me. I pictured myself driving to the song, like on a long solo road trip after all the music and podcasts are done, and it’s quiet, and you’re left with your thoughts. The way that translated into the video was me driving, and I wanted to double myself, a physical manifestation of talking to yourself, not as good and bad, but as two different energies within. I want the videos to complement the song, but they don’t have to match exactly. Sometimes it’s boring if a song matches the video too closely. I like them to be unexpected, and I want the viewer to be surprised, but still feel they complement each other.”

You have a distinct sonic and visual style. Who are some visual influences that do not impact your sound?

“I get really excited by film colour grades, and I definitely want to shout out Luke Penny, my director. He’s amazing. We can send a few references, and the video turns out just as I’d imagined. I can be inspired by visuals, but not always by soundtracks. Maybe it’s all connected. If I get a strand from something, it becomes part of the fabric of my vision. For my most recent song, Bodies, I knew I wanted the video to be inspired by Fight Club, the colours and style, but that’s not necessarily what inspired the song itself. I don’t have synesthesia, but the colours I see for the video and the song aren’t always the same. Sometimes I just need to see a reference, and it sparks an idea that brings things together.”

Is there another important aspect of your new song Bodies that you’d like to discuss?

"Yeah, I think Bodies is actually a song that revealed itself to me more, and I find that with all of the music, I start to understand more about what I’ve written about in hindsight. I don’t think I realise it at the time, because you’re being influenced by all the other sounds. I don’t know, I’m not thinking that analytically about it, but understanding the other day, it’s like, this is so much about being a stunt double, which is what I did for quite a while, to be this replaceable body. It is such a cool job, and I really enjoyed my time, but there were occasions on set where you’d go, wow, I am really the thing you can throw into the wall, and if I break, you’ll just go and get another one. I really just feel like another body.

The other thing I found was that I had seen The Substance and the Beauty culture on different platforms, and I found it really interesting in this world where we continue to augment ourselves. It is a distant perception of what LA is like, its epicentre. Nothing against anyone who’s doing any kind of change to their bodies, but the way it’s normalised with these big, drastic changes, people become these bodies that start to feel like empty shells, especially when they can’t express emotion. That ability to feel is what makes you human. That is what makes you different from AI. You are not just a body.

Even thoughts like, "If you smile for 30 seconds, you can change your mood." If we can’t frown or express other emotions, do we lose the ability to be empathetic, or do we become numb as humans? All those thoughts were swirling around when I was thinking about bodies, the narcissism, and these other elements. When are you too far gone, and when do you become something you don’t recognise as a person or even as your physical self? These were things I understood in hindsight about what I was writing about."

I also find it interesting what you said about LA, because I've spoken to a few musicians now, and it seems like LA While it's highly creative, it seems to be this place where, like,a lot of that identity is lost so I wonder what it…what it is about?

“I think there is also that thing about America… and an American said this the other day, it's like, we are, so forward-facing, and appearance as, I guess, a nation is very important, so I guess that's the sort of boiling spot for it in LA. It's interesting what you're saying about, um, a place that's sort of known for its creativity, or creation, in the sense that that's where Hollywood is, and that's where all that kind of thing is. Where, if anything, if people are losing their individuality, and creation looks like one Or, like, maybe 5 acceptable things, and if it's not that, it's sort of two different, which is, yeah, an interesting… like, I don't… yeah, I don't think I have a proper answer for it, but, yeah, it's a really interesting conversation.

A lot of artists I talk to say you can't be creative without knowing who you are and really expressing yourself, so it's really interesting that one of the most creative cities in the world is also the place where identity is lost most.

"I wonder if part of it is, like, how you said you have to know where you are. I mean, I haven't lived in LA enough to, like, tell you how it is. Part of creation is the discovery of who you are, and I think you have to allow yourself to not know. rather than hurrying to put on a mask. to have already kind of sorted it. is not…how you find that kind of stuff, and your identity is always changing, it changes at different ages, and like you said, sort of depending where you are, part of the process of creation is not knowing. You have to not know before you create. I always find it's like an unveiling of something to myself when I'm sort of in the purest form. So I think you have to be okay with not knowing, and maybe it's that in LA, you need to have the answer because you need to be able to tell people exactly who you are."

What advice would you offer to young creatives pursuing their art?

"Any young creative coming up, you will feel different. You’re a creative, so you’ll always feel different, and that feeling is okay. It’s okay not to know, and you don’t have to become something. You spend your whole life becoming. I haven’t become anything. I’m still on the journey of being who I am. You can be inspired by other people, and that’s amazing, but be careful not to just recreate what someone else has done, because that isn’t interesting. They’ve already done it.

When you think you’re lost, you’re often learning. Those moments where you don’t know what you’re doing are really important. There is no failure. It doesn’t exist. There is redirection. It’s new information and a new experience, and you have no idea what that will inform in your next project."

How has growing up in New Zealand shaped your approach to global music and your creative process?

"I think one thing about growing up in New Zealand is that I grew up on a farm, so I wasn’t always inside listening to music. I was surrounded by nature. I got a rope swing for Christmas and was so excited about it. I had such an outdoor childhood. Music was something that happened around food and in cars. It wasn’t always on.

Growing up in New Zealand and in the music industry here, people often say it’s a small pond, but a huge advantage is that you can meet all the important people. They’re all a coffee away. Most people are easy to reach. If someone burns bridges, it’s not a big enough space to do that. There aren’t enough bridges to burn. There are significant advantages to being here rather than leaving immediately for overseas. There are so many resources in New Zealand and places like Parachute Studios and Big Fan that want to help local artists. They are inviting and supportive. I don’t know if you have that as much overseas."

Listen to Bodies here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCYLE2UH-Dc